拉康論移情 1123i

拉康論移情 1123i

THE SEMINAR OF JACQUES LACAN BOOK VIII
拉康研討班第八冊

Transference 論移情

1960 – 1961
Translated by Cormac Gallagher from unedited French typescripts
Cormac Gallagher 根據未編輯的法語錄音英譯

Seminar 2; Wednesday 23 November 1960

Here, schoolboys are acneed and cretinised by the education they receive and these conditions are not really favourable for them to become the
object of our homage; it seems that one has to go searching for objects in out of the way places, the gutter, that is the whole difference.

在此,學童形同被他們接受的教育制式化及矮化。這種的情況對於他們變成我們尊重的客體,並不見得有利。似乎,我們必須尋求客體,從遙遠的地方,貧民區。那才是差異所在。

But there is no difference in the structure itself. (14) Naturally this causes scandal, given the outstanding dignity with which we have invested the Greek message.

在結構的本身,並沒有什麼差異。當然,這會引起醜聞,假如考慮到,我們曾經給予古希臘的訊息投注令人尊敬的威望。

And then there are the fine sentiments with which one surrounds oneself for this purpose, namely that we are told: all the same you must not
believe that for all that women did not receive appropriate homage.

因此為了這個目標,我們替自己環繞高貴的情感。換句話說,我們被告訴:同樣的,你們一定不要相信:儘管那樣,女人並沒有接受適當的尊重。

Thus Socrates, do not forget, precisely in the Symposium, where, as I told you, he says very little in his own name – but what he speaks is extraordinary – only he makes a woman speak in his place: Diotima.

因此,蘇格拉底,不要忘記,確實就在「饗宴」,如同我告訴你們的。他很少以自己的名義說話—但是他所言說的是很特別—他僅是讓一位女人代替他說話:帝奧提瑪。

Do you not see that the testimony, that the supreme homage comes back, even in the mouth of Socrates, to the woman?

你們看出嗎?這個證詞,從蘇格拉底的嘴中,最高的尊重回到這個女人?

Here at any rate is what right thinking people never fail at this point to highlight for us; and in addition, you know that from time to time he would go to visit Lais, Aspasia – historians collect all sorts of gossip – Theodota who was Alcibiades’ mistress.

無論如何,此時此刻,人們一定會跟我們強調適當的思想。除外,你們知道,有時他常常去探訪萊斯、阿帕西亞—-歷史學家們收集各種的八卦傳聞—希奧德達是阿西比底斯的情婦。

And as regards the famous Xanthippes, about whom I spoke to you the other day, she was there the day he died as you know, and she even gave out the most deafening cries.

關於著名的冉希匹斯,我前天跟你們提到他,你們知道阿西比底斯死亡時,她在現場,她甚至發出最震耳欲聾的哀哭聲。

There is only one problem… this is attested for us in the Phaedo, in any case, Socrates suggests that she should be put to bed immediately, that she should be got out at quickly as possible so that they can talk calmly, there are only a few hours left.

只有一個問題、、、在「費德」章節,我們獲得證實。無論如何,蘇格拉底建議,應該趕她去睡覺,她應該儘快被被驅出,這樣他們才能安靜地談話,僅剩幾個小時而已

Except for this, the function of the dignity of women will be preserved. I have no doubt in fact about the importance of women in antique Greek society, I would say even more, it is something very serious whose import you will subsequently see.

除了這一點,女人的尊嚴的功用將會被保持。事實上,關於古希臘社會,女人的重要性,我沒有懷疑。我甚至會說,這是某件嚴肅的事情,它的意義,你們隨後會看出。

It is that they had what I would call their true place. Not alone did they have their true place, but this means that they had a quite outstanding weight in love relationships and we have all sorts of testimonies of this.

他們擁有我所謂的他們真實的位置。他們不但擁有他們真實的位置,而且這意味著,他們在愛的關係,擁有傑出的地位。我們對於這一點,擁有各種的證詞。

It appears in fact, provided always that one knows how to read – one must not read the antique authors with wire netting on one’s glasses – that they had this role which is veiled for us but nevertheless is very
outstandingly their own in love: simply the active role, namely that the differences between the antique woman and the modern woman is that she demanded her due, that she attacked the man.

事實上,只有我們如何閱讀—我們一定不要用有色眼光,閱讀古代的作者—他們扮演他們我們無法理解的角色,可是這個角色,顯見就是她們自己在愛的的角色。換句話說,在古代女人與現代女人的差異,就是古代女人要求她應得的角色,她攻擊男人。

This is something that you can, I believe, put your finger on in
many cases. In any case when you have woken up to this point of
view on the question you will notice many things which otherwise,
in ancient history, seem strange. In any case Aristophanes who
was a very good music-hall producer, did not dissimulate from us
how the women of his time behaved.

這是某件你們做得到的事情。我相信,無論如何,請你們理解。無論如何,當你們醒悟到對於這個問題的這一個觀點,你們將不會注意到許多事情,在古代歷史,那些事情否則會很奇怪。無論如何,亞力斯多芬是一位很好的音樂廳的製作人,他並沒有跟我們掩飾,他當代的女人是如何行為。

There has never been anything more characteristic and more crude concerning the enterprises – as I might say – of women. And it is precisely
for that reason that learned love – as I might call it – took refuge elsewhere.

關於女人的表現,我不妨說,當時的表現是最具有特色而且粗曠。確實是因為這個理由,學習獲得的愛躲避到別的地方–容我如此稱呼。

We have here in any case one of the keys for the question which
should not astonish psychoanalysts too much.

無論如何,對於這個問題,我們在此所擁有的,精神分析師們不應該太過吃驚。

(15) This may appear perhaps quite a long detour to excuse the fact that in our enterprise (which is to analyse a text whose object is to know what it means to know about love) we take something obviously, we take what we know, that it refers to the time of Greek love, this love as I might say of the school, I mean of schoolboys.

為了解釋這個事情,我可能看起來繞了一大圈子。我們精神分析的努力,(那就是要分析一個文本,目的是要知道:愛是什麼意思),我們顯而易見地採取某件東西,我們接受我們知道的東西,它提到古希臘人的愛。我不妨說,這是學園之愛,我的意思是學生之愛。

Well, it is for technical reasons of simplification, of example, of a model which allows to be seen an articulation that otherwise is always elided in what is too complicated in love with women, it is because of this that this love of the school can be of use to us, can legitimately be of use to all (for our object) as a school for love.

呵呵,為了讓專業術語簡化,我舉個例子,舉個模式,容許大家明白這種表達。否則對於女人的愛,問題會太複雜而閃爍。因為這樣,這個學園之愛,對於我們會有點用途,作為我們的客體,它理當會有點用途,作為愛的學園。

This of course does not mean, that this is something to be relaunched. I would like to avoid any misunderstanding, because soon people will be saying that I am setting myself up here as a proponent of Platonic love.

當然,這並不意味著,這是可以重新再開張的事情。我想要避免任何的誤解,因我不久人們將會說,我正在這裏大張旗鼓,充當柏拉圖式的愛的宣導者。

There are many reasons why this can no longer serve as a school for love. If I were to tell you about them, this would again be a question of giving great sword thrusts through curtains when one does not know what there is behind – believe me – in general I avoid it.

有很多理由為什麼這不再充當愛的學園。若是我想要告訴你們這些,那將是把劍戮穿簾幕,我們不知道後面是什麼—請相信我—通常我避免這樣幹。

雄伯譯
32hsiung@pchome.com.tw
https://springhero.wordpress.com

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